Husband, A Mummy's Boy Phenomenon - A Matter Of Grave Concern!

Dear Dharma,

Thanks for your long post so full of practical advice to the new dil, that I for a moment suspect that you have been both a mil and dil.

In spite of being branded a controversial writer (who discusses gossip, hypocrisy and jealousy so openly) I tend to take up more of such topics because

a) we need to have a fair knowledge of the dynamics involved in all these complex situations so that we do not trip when we are in one.
b) Second topics like this attract greater participation and a wider range of views so that we have a complete picture. This thread itself is an example. The thread was started by a son and a son-in-law and has participation from many daughters-in-law, mothers-in-law, sisters-in-law, and even by a father and a father-in-law.

Dharma, you have given very many practical hints on winning over the mil. They are very useful hints like the recipes available in this wonderful site. But I would like to add two more points in that regard.

a) Yes, in the past mothers-in-law have been won over by very simple strategies - like openly praising her (extending to the level of chamchagiri at times) asking the husband not to be soft in mil's presence and so on. The only raider I want to introduce here is that this strategy should not reduce the dil to the level of mere cleverness in the absence of love.

b) Some women are bold and straight forward. I have a couple of women friends who are candid and courageous. When their mil tried to harass them they told her point blank that they could not tolerate such non-sense and walked out of their marital home. Some said those women were foolish. But my opinion is "Hats Off" . Some women cannot bend and cringe. They would rather forego a comfortable life than stand even a miniscule damage to their self-esteem. So my suggestion is presenting them these ideas is, prioritize your goals. Understand the consequences of your action and then act accoringly. With another word of caution, that the same problem might show its ugly head if you divorce this man and marry another.

When it comes to prejudice and bigotry, usually the mil has far more of them than the dil. A dil suffering at the hands of her mil is far more a frequent occurence than the other way round.

If IL wants to serve the community in this direction, it should rope in many mothers-in-law as its members and make them read threads like this.

And finally a word of caution to the mothers-in-law. If your boy is brought up as a mama's boy, then a clever dil would immediately transform him as a "pendatti daasan" "a wife's man" . Then you cant expect to receive any fairness or justice from your son.

Dharma, thanks once again for the participation.

Regards,
varalotti

Hello Meena,

The idea of discussing these things is to just to keep the new dil informed that her life at her mil's place will not be a bed of roses. At the same time if I had given the impression that by reading these things one can easily master any situation, then I am sorry. These posts will give only an insight into the working of a mil's mind, and that too in general terms. So the one rule which we should never forget is that there are no set rules to follow in this regard. You have brought this point very well in the first two lines of your post.

Another candid expression I like is that a mil can never be like a mother to a dil nor a dil, a daughter to her mil. If somebody says I am a mil but like a mother to my dil. Well, I would say it is unadulterated bull-shit. Even the noblest of mothers-in-law are not mothers to their daughters-in-law. The love a woman has for her daughter is different from the one she has (?) for her dil.

That's why our ancestors wisely devised a scheme of sending the dil to her mother's place for her delivery. Even the richest and the most loving mil cannot provide what her mother does.

Anthropologists, scientists who have studied human beings and human socieites, say that between the dominators and the dominated, it is the former who are better strategists. It is like the ruling party contesting in a bye-election. They have all the advantages. One has to take all the strategies advised to a dil with a pinch of salt.

And as you clearly pointed out before embarking on a project of changing a mama's boy, one should assess whether the game is worth the candle. If the situation is hopeless, with the boy not being independent and the mil harassing, at times the best solution will be to silently walk away from the marriage. Formerly that choice was not there. But now with that choice daughters-in-law have some choice in these matters.

Well I dont agree with your statement that MILs want to be leaders. A true leader has the interest of her followers in her mind. But a mil never does have such an attitude. The dreaded bad-mil wants only to be a dominatrix and a politician. And there lies the whole problem.

Nice to know about the "inherited properties" and their role in the in-laws relationship.

regards,
sridhar

Hi,

Being a wife, mother and expecting to be a mother in law in the future, I dont understand how a woman can hurt her own children in the name of love.

As a wife when a woman expects her hubby to listen to her and not to his mother, she should be able to let go of her son also when he gets married == so in my opinion, , I really dont get it all.

Tolerance first of all and compromise should be the key in any relationship, I feel.

1) Nowadays working mothers themselves are less tolerant towards their own kids and they also want to enjoy their lives and not be bound to the home duties which are expected of grandparents. They want to have a comfortable and leisurely life with all the trappings and no duties.

2) Since the paypackets of the children today are more than the combined monthly earning of the parents, the relationship is suffocating within the family -- so when a DIL enters the family, naturally the first idea in the MIL's mind would be that how do I get my share of his earnings?

Ofcourse there are exceptions everywhere!!!!!!!

Chitra

Dear Sridhar,
you have dared to bring forth a topic, there are people of various walks of life nd it is really enlightening to read all the posts. I am happy that men, even fils, have taken the sides of the hapless dil. It sure shows that times are changing for the better.
I, for one know the difficulties of having married a Mama's boy. My hubby is the third and last son, he has 2 elder brothers. My inlaws had him and his immediate brother after a gap of 17 years from the first one. My mil took good advantage of her last son, she made him dance to her tunes and achieved whatever she could not get done thro her other sons and husband. It sure brings back very bitter memories of those days, when I was treated as a third person and not as a family member. The dil is there only to do household chores, take the verbal assault without a murmer and bear children. That is the way my in laws lived.
Adjusting to the household etc. will not bear fruit for the dil, it is my experience. In laws themselves had no good traits in them and so did not bother to correct the children. Actually, mil would do things which are wrong, just because hubby liked them and thus show that she is all concern for her son. But when he is not there, he will be criticised badly by the parents and brothers. He was ustilised because he will give money and whatever they needed with out any hitch. The other sons were very shrewd and would not even want to take responsibility of the parents.
I have borne with all that in the hope that my hubby would realise someday. But, it is too late now to try to change him and bring him back to the right track.
All this is due to the believes and practises of the society, the gender differences etc. When sons are brought up in such a way that they think and take decisions on their own, such HAMBs will become extinct. Men should be taught to respect women in general as fellow human beings, no need to put women on a pedestal at all. Dils should be welcomed as an integral part of the family and son. And mothers should prepare themselves mentally to keep away from the son and his family. No point in directing his life all the time.
I have vowed that I shall not interfere in anybody's life, for that matter, after a period. I keep myself away from pain this way. I always tell my 15 year old son to think about what I say to him before deciding the course of action. I let him be and am trying to distance myself from him emotionally. It is rather difficult, but I am sure by practice I shall perfect that.
I am a dil, wife, mother and later I shall be a mil. I would say that the wife could become a mother to her husband, but the mother could not be a wife to the son. The Tamil films have created this myth that the mother is only important for a son, but not for a daughter (her hubby is important to her). I feel that each relationship has a place in a person's life and he or she should know it and act accordingly.
I have bored all with my outpour, but what are friends for?

Dear all,

I think my ideas are reflected in Varalakshmey's mail also where she has stated her difficulty of being HAMB's wife, because of her inlaws doings. But not to expect anything from her son will take a lot of will power == Because petha manam pithu, Illiyaa?

So when parents are out to take advantage of their son/s, what will the DIL do but to resort to the same things with her son so that her life is also comfortable.

So vazhaiadi vazhaiyai intha tradition valarndhu konde irukkirathu.

So where does this all stop? It should be the sons who should realize this and bring about an equilibrium between the two women who want the best of his life. :rolleyes: :confused:

All said and done, my sympathies and prayers for such women who are affectedby HAMBs

Chitra

Hi Sumathi,
Thanks for your interim response. This is an interim reply to the interim response. Will give a detailed reply for your detailed post.
thanks once again,
sridhar

I have heard of that system, Seena. In fact even among Kerala Hindus we have a sort of matriarchal society. The famous Marumakkathaayam or Aliyasanthanam, where a persons nephew - sisters son - acquires the property is partly based on this.

And we have a system of Veetu Maapillai in all the places. Where the girl is very rich the boy leaves his parents to live with his inlaws. I have some very rich friends like that.

If we logically extend our theory those women (who live with their parents as well as their spouses) should be very happy. But it does not happen like that. A man living with his in-laws is not given as much respect or dignity as he deserves. When the girls father or brother belittles him, the woman gets seriously hurt.

And there is another problem. Please do not think I am just talking in favour of women. Or against men. But this is an observed fact. Women are at least a hundred times more capable than men in adjusting with strangers. So a man living with his in-laws creates a hundred times more problems than a woman. So at some level the existing system is better.

Like DILs, MILs also fall into different categories. You might not have heard about the worst categories, Seena. Just have a peep at the relevant thread in the Family and Relationship forum. Many ILites have lamented about their incredibly harsh MILs. So with some harmless category who are particular about the external form, this kind of "heating- up-the- snacks-technique" will work. Others are frying their own DILs as snacks. There all this winning over, strategy etc will not work.

While the MILs should attend personality development workshops to broaden their vision and deepen their love, the DILs should attend personality assessment workshops to place their MIL in the right category.

In these days there's already enough tension between the husband and wife because of various factors. If the in-laws also add their share, then the foundation of marriage as an institution will be shaken.

regards,
sridhar

Hi Shanvy,

You asked, “Why are girls papa's pet and boys mama's..... i think somebody will write a book like papa's girl.. mama's boy...”

Here is my answer, Because, we, girls see our father as a role model, or as a hero (almost) / first man in our life. So, we keep them as bench mark and scale all others with that scale.

Same for boys, even today my husband used to say about his ‘amma’s samayal’ , even though I am cooking like her. (his amma is my ‘patti as well as MIL, who taught me how to cook. Almost I am using her recipes only). In this all men are equal, all of them like their own amma’s samayal and they will tell, that there is no ‘equivalent samayal’ in the world. I hope you will agree with me.

Hi Sumathi,

Thanks for the detailed post. It was worth waiting for that till you finished your nonbu.

One thing I want to clear at the outset is that the men affected by HAMB phenomenon are a separate sick lot who cannot think for themselves and who have not yet severed the metaphorical umblical chord that connects them to their mothers. Now asking them to think on their own is like asking a goat to fly.

And expecting a HAMB to apprise about his family to his new wife so that she can adjust to the new surroundings is like asking a tortoise to fly. We can ask, but it wont happen.

So we are left with some practical solutions only.

Judging a dispute between ones wife and mother - thats a man's worst nightmare. An intelligent man will never do that.

Classes for MILs is a wonderful idea. But we need to make them attend. That is the issue. The best way is to have classes for DILs as well. And have a few sessions for DILs and MILs. Again it is very difficult to make them attend.

Make them visit our site Indusladies. And hear from a lot of other DILs and MILs about their experiences. That will give an insight into the working of a persons mind.

As you very rightly said a wife can play the role of a mother; but the other way round is impossible.

The new girl is treated as a villain because she enters the man's life precisely at the time when the mothers function is almost complete. Mothers post has been very powerful and she has been holding sway over her children for so many years. When she sees that her tenure is going to end, she wants to just adamantly sit on her seat for some more time. Well here some more time means infinity.

Again at that time the MILs do not have anything to do. Their duties are over. They would be in menopausal stage. Which will again heighten the feeling of insecurity. And they perceive the newly wed DIL as their villain and rack their brains to somehow throw her out.

MILs need to develop some other interest. They should be practising some art, or have the practice of reading books, browsing the net. So long as they are otherwise productively occupied the HAMB phenomenon will not have much of a sting.
You have ended your post sentimentally
Ladies of our age group (in 40s) should take an oath that,

The struggle what we had/have with our MIL, we will not revenge on our DIL. We love our DILs as we do with our sons. [

Sumathi, I bow down to your sentiments. But as a person who has seen many a summer let me just issue this caveat. We cannot trust a human mind just like that. I know MILs who took a similar oath when they suffered under their MILs. But on seeing their DIL they started behaving in the same fashion. We are more likely than not to be tricked by our ego.
I'll tell you how. When a MIL is torturing her DIL, the latter will shower all her affection on her children. She will become so fiercely protective of them that when her son gets married very naturally the DIL will be perceived as a threat.

But I am happy you are creating an awareness in the direction. Those of the women in their 40s who have sons, you take one more oath also.
"I will insist that my DIL should become a member of Indusladies."
Well that way we can atleast know what's happening and the DIL will have some kind of an outlet for her grievances.

Thanks Sumathi for the nice post,
sridhar

Dear Shanti,

Thanks for the participation and the kind words. Well, Shanti, believe me I am not such a "know-all" person that I can claim that I can answer these questions. I am only attempting to bring some insights into this troublesome HAMB phenomenon. And you get insights by asking questions. Not by providing answers. I am not that naive to think I can answer the questions. I am only refining their questions and directing them towards some workable solutions.

Almost all the topics I have got only from this forum. Some ILites PM me about the topics that need discussion. Even HAMB was suggested by an ILite in her pm to me.
So you are most welcome to make any suggestions in this regard. Either in the open forum or if you dont want it, by pm to me.

regards,
sridhar