Discipline Has Changed

Dear shanthi happy to meet you here and thanks for your views.

Actually in the afternoon I drafted a long reply ,that I lost and could not retrieve. So putting it here again. I want to hightlight a bullying incident that happened last month.

Here starting from KGs the teachers tell the kids not to bully and if being bullied complain to them and do not fight, Only few kids (like my son) take these words to their heart and follow and it was OK there since the smaller class size. But once they enter the primary school,(he started in January,) the kids from various KGs/backgrounds/races end up together and class size is bigger too.
Starting from day 1, DS was bullied by his classmate (pushing/ throwing the books, tripping etc) I was telling the teacher abt it and I got the answer ,she was disciplining the boy. Then I was enraged and reached my boiling point when the bully, took off his shoes and put the smelly feet on my son's nose and also threaten him to push from the 2nd floor corridor. When I demanded action from school, the result was a warning to his parents. The best part was the teacher explaining me and DH and DS that thae bully was an angry child and so he is acting that way. DH and I have no other choice but to insist DS everyday that he hit back to defend himself and we will face the consequences later.
My son's DF/GF?classmate also faces a bully everyday. 3 weeks ago she was pushed and knocked her head on an iron pole in the school fitness corner. The worst part is the school didnt even inform abt the head injury to the parents until the school dispersed in the evening. They said , they "monitered" her in the school. I was wondering whether they are 'teacher" or "doctors". There is no residential nurse in this school also. This incident happened even after the mother was complaining abt the bully to the class teacher and also the bully's mother. The bully's mother had the guts to say that she could not handle the boy and not to take him seriously. The worst case is the punishment for the bully in this case is also a warning to the bully's parents and a lenghty speech abt bullying by the Principal in the assembly..
Who is to be blamed here.
Nowadays I pray for my son's safety at school everyday and ask DS to keep on complaining to teacher abt the bully if he repeats it again,

AC,
I am with you in this regard....
Parents should not interfere with the activites of the school in the way of discipline...
But if that discipline is absurd, parents should have a say ....

Who will discipline the children...either it must at home or in school during those years...

sriniketan

Hi AC:

In my opinion, it all depends on the teacher or the school authority. How they handle the situation.

I volunteer in my daughter's school and have seen teachers bring their children to behave with just a tough talk not even a harsh tone and this seems really polite when compared to the verbal abuse some of us got during our schooling. Ofcourse, there are instances when I thought maybe the punishments (which mostly is time outs or no play time) have to be increased. It seems like the teachers hold themselves back from going a bit further.

The children here are accustomed to being spoken politely and gently that they cannot take a few harsh words. My son thinks one of his teachers is strict since he heard her use harsh words (not directed at him at all) - forget punishments. And there was another instance when my daughter refused to go to her swimming lessons, since she thought her coach was strict which is equivalent to not enough smiles and not enough jokes! What do you have to say to that? Are they getting too much of a good thing?

I do agree though to what Indusguy says about we being what we are - thanks to our parents and not because of our teachers. Teachers have a definite influence but home has the most influence on young minds.

Sindhu

Originally Posted by padmavathi m

dear AC,

Discipline is taught only during the childhood...................so i feel there is no harm when the child is punished for misbehaving, not following rules and regulations......though my daughter, being a dyslexic, had problems with her teachers in the school, i would always tell her to adjust and that she is becoming more strong and strong each day .................

love
padma

Dear Padmavathi
Nice balanced reply.. especially since your daughter is having dyslexia. I too agree it would help the child grow stronger and more balanced.. In reality life is too full of difficulties and molly coddling a child would do more harm than good in the long run:)

Originally Posted by aishu22

Dear AC,
As always,There are two sides of the coin - This act , done in US was given with a punishment of staying back in school whish is no harm and i too support the minority side of you ppl.But in India, its just extreme on both sides.Either the students are given with extreme corporal punishments or the teachers are taunted enough.Though u get to hear incidents about only the first part, i can vouch for the second part.

My Aunt is a High school Maths Teacher working for a Management school.Once she found a girl copying in the Half yearly exam.She caught hold of her and took her to the Principal's office as in ur case.The principal warned her and demanded for an explanation thats it.Nothing more happened.The girl was allowed to write the next exam with a warning.But this girl, though that as a prestige issue and attempted to fall from the second floor of the school, but rescued by the school aayas and some teachers.I see no wrong in the teachers action or in the Principal action.But, next day her parents came with"arivaal" and taunted & passed on remarks about the Teacher(my aunt) and the Principal.

Dear Aishu
If its Arivaal there its lawsuits here.. most teachers and administration staff hesitate to even reprimand a child for fear of harassment. Each case should be treated differently and appropriate discipline to be meted out depending on nature of incident. In what you mention there is no wrong in taking the kid to principal's office but the whole matter was blown out of proportion.

Originally Posted by Sriniketan

AC,
I am with you in this regard....
Parents should not interfere with the activites of the school in the way of discipline...
But if that discipline is absurd, parents should have a say ....

Who will discipline the children...either it must at home or in school during those years...

sriniketan

Dear Bhargavi
AS always a balanced reply.. yes if its too unjust parents should interfere. My son too has got detention etc.. but we never interfered. we know him very well and we trusted the teachers concerned..today he is more careful how he talks and says things.. This discipline is ongoing process.. need to be done in school and home:)

Hi AC,
I agree that now a days discipline has changed.
It is not a physical harm now a days.
I am with you totally.... parents should not interfere with school discipline.
It is for our kids good that teacher would punish them.

Regards.

Originally Posted by sindhurao

Hi AC:

In my opinion, it all depends on the teacher or the school authority. How they handle the situation.

I volunteer in my daughter's school and have seen teachers bring their children to behave with just a tough talk not even a harsh tone and this seems really polite when compared to the verbal abuse some of us got during our schooling. Ofcourse, there are instances when I thought maybe the punishments (which mostly is time outs or no play time) have to be increased. It seems like the teachers hold themselves back from going a bit further.

The children here are accustomed to being spoken politely and gently that they cannot take a few harsh words. My son thinks one of his teachers is strict since he heard her use harsh words (not directed at him at all) - forget punishments. And there was another instance when my daughter refused to go to her swimming lessons, since she thought her coach was strict which is equivalent to not enough smiles and not enough jokes! What do you have to say to that? Are they getting too much of a good thing?

I do agree though to what Indusguy says about we being what we are - thanks to our parents and not because of our teachers. Teachers have a definite influence but home has the most influence on young minds.

Sindhu

my dear Sindhu
I am reminded of a couple I know..young in 20's.. born and brought up in U.S..after marraige could not get along.. main problem was girl complained boy is raising his voice and fighting..sometimes too much softness and politeness is not good..though we love are son there is no special special treatment.. we behave and treat him normally so he grows up balanced..kid glove treatment doesnot help in the long run.. But sometimes a look or strong word is sufficient too..dont have to yellor beat etc.. But sometimes stronger discipline as staying after school or lunch duty etc is needed.. when my son once talked back to a staff they gave him 2hr detention after school.. we did not interfer as we know he would have done it and he needs to learn thats not acceptable. Its very interesting to read all the views:)

Hi AC,
I think discipling the kids is important at every point of life.......and should start from home itself.....a kid who will be disciplined at home, will behave well at other places too.
I am basically from a school where punishment is banned.....forget abt kneel down and canned.....so, giving punishment by physically harassing a kid seems weired to me. Psychologically, it will make kids hide things in fear of punishment, and I don't think, doing something secretely is good in terms of child's development.
Thouhg punishment was banned in our school but it was there at my home (not for me though but for my brother as he used to be mischevious at times) but when I see things from back and analyse it, it was not only his fault...sometimes the bad mood of parents......pressure was the reason......and whatever be the reason, it used to put a scar in the mind of the kid.......none of the animal will trust an abuser, forget abt human being.....so, punishment for the kids is a big NO......NO.....for me.
Rather the parents should be punished for not teaching kids how to behave......
A child's mind is like molten wax......its upto you how you mould them in life.....
Regards.

Hi AC:

Came back since I thought my reply was incomplete.

As long as there is no abuse involved as a part of discipline, I am of the opinion that we should not interfere with the teacher's / school's punishment. Detention is not bad at all. Yes, like you said a stern look, a tough tone sometimes is enough to discipline the children.

About the Cellphones in school - In my son's school, the phones are collected before the school starts and handed back to them after school. But ofcourse, it is a school of 500, so maybe small relatively that it can be done.

Sindhu