Child Labour

Originally Posted by pavithrasriram

dear kamlaji,
i saw your post before but waited to watch the programme on bbc about it so that i could write better.well the programme was definitely a eye-opener one!loads of people here buy cheap clothes due to fast fashion but at the same time they don't want it at the cost of child labour or other person being exploited.
in this case its not boycotting because obviously it will not help these children but imposing ethical policies and paying the minimum wage in that country which sadly lots of them dont get paid.
also i would like to share with you the information that these children who were found out by the bbc are promised education and the workers better conditions by the company here.so atleast these children will get a better future!
and as for ngo's there is one called bba which rescues children from child labour back to their hometown for education incase they are abandoned these kids are educated in a school run by the organisation's founder mr.bhuvan.this organisation claims to have rescued around 30,000 children so far.

also experts have suggested that it is the the uk company's responsibility to gives its exporters some time to adjust to their ethical policies which they stated as work kept within the factories which are regularly inspected by officers and people working normal working hours (as some workers claimed in the programme for working 2 days continuosly)and the minimum wage to be paid according to the country's policies,instead of cancelling their contracts which would have hit the worst even more!!!!

this programme has definitely been an eye-opener here and all i can say is we should support organisations like bba to help such children so that we have a better future for them as well as India.
regards
pavi

Dear Pavi,

Let me explain.No exporter or businessman will ever employ children.We give our work of Embroidery, stitching, and so many other things on Job Work to elderly persons who are expiernced in their jobs, who wont spoil our goods.

Now what and whom they employ we don’t know.And let me tell you, no boss, even if he keeps a child, will ever promise the child for education.that is the parent’s job, not the employer’s.

This NGO may have rescued children, but look at it this way.they educate kids , fine, but they should nip the problem in the bud, but making sure no more kids are produced by the poor.So this is no solution really.


These days Pavi, no one works overtime for free.these workers take u for a ride.For 8 hours they are paid a day;s salary, and for the next 4 again another day;s salary.Plus food for 25/- given, and plus tea.And they work slow during their regular hours, I have seen that as I employ people to work in my office, so that they can get to work overtime, get the same for half the hours.These guys are smarter than u and me.


The Buyer , should be concerned with the quality and timely delivery, instead of going into how the goods are made.this is not their concern.

Regards.kamal

Originally Posted by Devika Menon

Dear Kamalji,

A very sensitive issue here!

Child labour has wiped out the childhood of many kids. They are born with a responsibility.The tiny hands have never held toys, their feet have never been used for running around and playing.Their sleep is not a peaceful one but an exhausted one.Its so sad to see these kids , a victim of circumstances succumbing to the pressures of life and growing up without even knowing that their best phase(childhood) is already over!!

We see child laboureres everywhere.Hotels , bidi factories, firework factories, etc. For the economic convenience the employer engage them in work and pay them almost half the salalry than he would to an adult for the same amount of work done or probably more. They remain malnourished and all this backfires with serious health issues and no money for treatment. They work for longer hours and their innocence is often misinterpreted as fear. They do not know the rules so they go about whats asked of them.The completely exploit the children.

Govt.keeps telling that Child labour is banned , but no the Govt will not do anything about it. It has to come from the people, From us , from you and me, to be able to stop it to some extent ,or at least see to it that they get their due.

A really sensitive issue Kamalji .Loved reading it!!

Regards,
Devika

Dear Devika,

I agree to all that u say about lost childhood.But u and me don’t give birth to make our kids work do we ?Blame the parents who breed like Rabbits, and bring this misery for all of us.

And tell me honestly, have u or me never ever employed child labour ? We have maids who are kids, we drink tea on the roadside which is delivered to shops by kids,does that mean u and mean will not drink tea on the roadsides ? We don’t force a child into slavery, we pay for the work done.We don’t force the child to come to work , they are borught to us.


All this is unique to Asian and poor countries, who are we to judge ?If u and me set out to solve India’s problems be sure we will be soon in a Lunatic Aslyum.


I feel sad but that’s the way it is Devika.Regards.kamal

Kamalji,

I agree with all your points except the child labour. Though you are true that if there is no child labour there will be more child beggers.
But it is not so humane to use those tender hands for the work.And I strongly support your point that they just sit in the carpetted homes and talks about all these things rather than trying to maaake their lives better.

I can see the same foreigners talking about the brand which uses the childlabour in India and abusing the Indian society but buying the clothes from same brand for their children.These are the people with doble standards.

Originally Posted by Balajee

The problem, Kamalji is that many people dont distinguish between child labour and slavery. While it is really bad to employ children as slaves paying them pittance or nothing and using them for dangerous jobs like making crackers, I dont see anything wrong in employing them in professions where they will learn a craft say in carpet weaving or embroidery that will stand them in good stead later provided they work under safe work ehviuronments. What would you prefer, poor children ending up as beggars or prostitutes or earning a respectable amount through work? On what basis do the whites fix the minimum wages? They dont realise that the purchasing power of a rupee in many areas is more than that of the dollar in the US. You can eat your fill for 10 rupees in many small towns of India still. These guys are often misguided by fake NGOs who make a living out of fat contributions from abroad.

Dear Balajee,

Yes u have clearly diffentiated between slavery and labour, well said.

Yes using them for crackers is badand what a wonderful point u made, that 10 Rupees may give u a full meal in India, while even 10 dollors may not be enough in America.
And the l;esser said about the NGO's the better really.

Great one.Regards.kamal

dear kamlaji
yes i do accept the fact that ngo's should work towards educing the population of poor children it's a pity that in india parents voluntarily send their children to work as they have an extra income in the household rather than educating them!!!
also as you said when the work is delegated the authorities don't know who they employ.thats what has happened in this case!the other reason that the exporters have stated is that the volume of order and demand is so high that they have to delegate orders to make their supply possible so as to get a continued customer.

i do understand that these workers are payed more for overtime and meals etc.
But the problem here is because of globalisation people have different priorities especially in the UK they are concerned about the welfare and human rights are given more imporatance unlike in INDIA and that's the reason people feel they are responsible when child labour is involved. and bothered as to who makes their good's.

the fact is the goods produced in india and china are cheaper than the goods produced here in the west and thus these countries face pressure to deliver to them so that they can make profits.

i know it is all easier said than done especially in India where have to face numerous problems,its just sad that these exporters are the once who have lost their business,struggling between these two worlds!!!!!
regards
pavi

Originally Posted by Kamalji

Dear Pavi,

Let me explain.No exporter or businessman will ever employ children.We give our work of Embroidery, stitching, and so many other things on Job Work to elderly persons who are expiernced in their jobs, who wont spoil our goods.

Now what and whom they employ we don’t know.And let me tell you, no boss, even if he keeps a child, will ever promise the child for education.that is the parent’s job, not the employer’s.

This NGO may have rescued children, but look at it this way.they educate kids , fine, but they should nip the problem in the bud, but making sure no more kids are produced by the poor.So this is no solution really.


These days Pavi, no one works overtime for free.these workers take u for a ride.For 8 hours they are paid a day;s salary, and for the next 4 again another day;s salary.Plus food for 25/- given, and plus tea.And they work slow during their regular hours, I have seen that as I employ people to work in my office, so that they can get to work overtime, get the same for half the hours.These guys are smarter than u and me.


The Buyer , should be concerned with the quality and timely delivery, instead of going into how the goods are made.this is not their concern.

Regards.kamal

Kamalji,
You had shown the other side of Child labour...your explanations to it seems fit in there...as you had pointed out it is in their parents hand to let them to work or not..
but whenever I see a child labour, my heart goes to them, irrespective of whether it is the parents fault or the employer's fault...

sriniketan

Originally Posted by krish22

Kamalji,

I agree with all your points except the child labour. Though you are true that if there is no child labour there will be more child beggers.
But it is not so humane to use those tender hands for the work.And I strongly support your point that they just sit in the carpetted homes and talks about all these things rather than trying to maaake their lives better.

I can see the same foreigners talking about the brand which uses the childlabour in India and abusing the Indian society but buying the clothes from same brand for their children.These are the people with doble standards.

Dear Krish,

Yes these foreigners have double standards really.They do what suits them.

A child should go for studies, but in the case of poor people who breed by the doxens, every child must bring home money to feed the family.So the choice is between the child getting money by begging or working.

So now tell me Krish, if the child has to bring money, is it better to work or to beg?

Regards.kamal

Originally Posted by pavithrasriram

dear kamlaji
yes i do accept the fact that ngo's should work towards educing the population of poor children it's a pity that in india parents voluntarily send their children to work as they have an extra income in the household rather than educating them!!!
also as you said when the work is delegated the authorities don't know who they employ.thats what has happened in this case!the other reason that the exporters have stated is that the volume of order and demand is so high that they have to delegate orders to make their supply possible so as to get a continued customer.

i do understand that these workers are payed more for overtime and meals etc.
But the problem here is because of globalisation people have different priorities especially in the UK they are concerned about the welfare and human rights are given more imporatance unlike in INDIA and that's the reason people feel they are responsible when child labour is involved. and bothered as to who makes their good's.

the fact is the goods produced in india and china are cheaper than the goods produced here in the west and thus these countries face pressure to deliver to them so that they can make profits.

i know it is all easier said than done especially in India where have to face numerous problems,its just sad that these exporters are the once who have lost their business,struggling between these two worlds!!!!!
regards
pavi

Dear Pavi,

U are right.the exporters are caught in a situation for no fault of theirs.
Indonesia, China and India, pakistan,Bangladesh,Sri Lanka all these poor countries have child labour, what can one do really.

And no exporter hires child labour.All our work is done by contract with the contractors, and who they employ we dont even come to know at times.

Regards.kamal

Originally Posted by Kamalji

Child Labour

I saw in the News a few days back about a UK Garment importing Firm banning 3 exporters from India from supplying them Readymade Garments as they accused them of employing child labour.


I am a garment exporter, so I can understand the trauma these Indian exporters must be going through.All their current orders stand still, their payments still due with the buyers will be stopped, and they will come to ruin very soon, and no other European Buyer will buy from them, as they will be blacklisted.

Dear Kamal
Not sure how I missed thir thread but coming in late I get to read some good comments esp from Pavithra Sriram. She has outlined some really good points and your reply to her is very good.
I found it very interesting to read this thread becuase you have given a different face to it. A different perspective and outlook.. from what I am used to reading about.
You are first addressing this issue as an exported in mind and the impact this would happen to the business.

Originally Posted by Kamalji

In a way I agree there should not be child labour.But for that first we must stop the production of children by the poorly who breed like rabbits.Sterilize them.But they need more kids , to supplement their income,so they don’t want to spend money on educating them like us.The fault lies with the parents of these children, and not the employers.

For all the NGO’s, who fight against child labour, have they taken any steps at the grassroot levels to tell and educate the parents against breeding children ? Or distributed condoms ? Or done anything other than raising slogans in 5 star hotels .Have they taken any kids and adopted them in their own plush homes to make them as good as their own kids ?



If we go by this yardstick, there will be more child beggars than child labourers very soon, and we would have sold our soul to the foreigners, like we once did a few hundred years back.A child labourer is better working than begging, as he gives good value to his employer for the money that he receives, if the choice is that he either begs or works.

You say there will be more child beggars soon? Maybe so. But their mentality is such that they would continue that trend. No they are not going to exercise birth control because in their minds they benefit with more children. This is actually universally true. In all countries there are people who exploit the Government and take advantage of the benefits by having more children...

Originally Posted by Kamalji

1) Child Labour – We order tea from the vendor, it is cheaper.For ourselves and the staff.Now how do we know if the vendor employs child labour.If that child is seen carrying Tea in yr office by the importer’s Rep, the above incident will happen.

2) Embroidery , Dyeing,beadwork, gold printing, - so many such jobs on the garments we give on contract labour to outside vendors.How do we know what labour they employ ?
3) English Toilet – The staff, who don’t have a toilet at home and live in chawls, where one toilet is shared by hundreds, where u have to take yr own water in a vessel, how the hell do they know how to use the Toilet with the Flush ?
4) Minimum Wages – I think are 5000 or more set by the Whites.Why should I pay 5000/ when the staff is ready to work for 3000/-.and working at those rates in the neighbourhood , of other businessmen, who do local work ? Why would u pay 5000 to someone who says they are happy with 3000/- ?

You say these are minimum wages set by the importers. True. But they are only guidelines. You can ofcourse employ someone with lesser pay as long as the quality does not suffer. Its my understanding the exporters employing cheaper labor always compromise on quality. And when the goods are rejected there is always a huge cry over it without realising the significance of QUALITY.

Child labor is a serious issue. Much has to be done about it. A lot also rests with the business owners who are responsible for such situations.
Awareness is the key to remove child labor and work towards removing child poverty as well.
Thanks for writing an eye opener and giving it in your perspective here.

Dear Kamalji, a fantastic topic. But like anything else in India, it has it's own big pros and cons. You have pointed out the small things that matter very much in this issue.

I agree with Santhosh, " Can't take responsibility - Can't have kids"..

A topics on this time Kamalji. Good to see it in the FP nominations.