The self-laid route to destruction – Bhagavad Gita Verses 2.62 &2.63

Discussion in 'Chitvish on Hindu Culture & Vedanta' started by Chitvish, Jun 12, 2008.

  1. Chitvish

    Chitvish Moderator IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    33,566
    Likes Received:
    3,756
    Trophy Points:
    490
    Gender:
    Female
    Now the Lord proceeds to point out the source of all evils in the case of the unsuccessful. The topic of the ladder of fall and hence the importance of mind discipline are discussed next.

    DhyaayathO vishayaan pumas: sangasthaeshupajaayathae
    Sangaath sanjaayathae kaama:kaamaath krOdhO(a)bhijaayathae 2.62

    For a person who is constantly thinking of the sense objects, a fondness for them arises.
    From fondness, desire is born.
    From desire, anger comes.

    This verse depicts one who is not turned towards the Divine, but towards sense objects. The Lord shows how such a man gradually sinks deeper and deeper into the mire of delusion until he perishes.

    Thought is a great force in man. It develops into desire, which, in turn translates itself into action, bringing glory or disgrace. "Anger" arises from weakness or inability to fulfill one's desires, although it is generally attributed to obstacles in the way of such fulfilment. And thus desire is said to be the direct cause of anger.

    Next, Krishna describes discrimination as a special trait of human culture.

    KrOdhaadbhavathi sammOha: sammOhaath smrithivibhrama:
    Smrithibhrams(h)aad buddhi naas(h)a: buddhinaas(h)aath praNas(h)yathi - 2.63

    From anger arises delusion.
    From delusion (results) the loss of memory.
    From the loss of memory (results) the loss of discrimination.
    Because of the loss of discrimination, he perishes.

    Anger excites the mind, which loses its balance and power of discrimination. It loses proper vision and foresight and a right sense of values. This state of "delusion" obscures the track of memory and thereby one feels, as if disconnected from the harmonious rhythm of life.
    Wisdom fails, intellect ceases to function. There is nobody to control the boat of life. As a matter of course, it meets with disaster.

    The intellect is the finest aspect of one's subjective nature. As long as the intellect is intact there is every hope of the advancement and fulfilment of life. That is why the Lord says, that the destruction of the intellect results in a man's ruin.

    A master psychologist cannot even now improve upon this biographical pattern of fall in a man who has no control over his own thinking equipment.

    Love,
    Chithra.


     
    Loading...

  2. Cheeniya

    Cheeniya Super Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    12,626
    Likes Received:
    16,903
    Trophy Points:
    538
    Gender:
    Male
    Dear Chithra
    In the old Tamil film classic, Thillana Mohanambal, there is a scene involving the comedienne Manorama and the legendary Sivaji Ganesan. Manorama is a folk artist in the film while Sivaji is a legendary Nadaswaram player. One day, Manorama entertains Sivaji to some folk music on the Nadaswaram. Suddenly she gets a doubt if Sivaji can produce the same Sublime music even on her instrument and requests him to play on it. Sivaji takes charges of the instrument and produces a brief note of music that transports everyone to a <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:eek:ffice:smarttags" /><st1:place><st1:placeType>land</st1:placeType> of <st1:placeName>Bliss</st1:placeName></st1:place>. When I first saw this scene in the film, I was stunned by its profundity. A musical instrument in the hands of a novice can produce only uninspiring sounds but the same instrument in the hands of an expert can create a wonderful magic of music. The basic notes of music are the same for every one but what a Divine web is woven by a great artist using the same basic notes!

    In a famous song written by Ilango Adigal rendered famous by the legendary MS Subbulakshmi titled Vadavaraiyai Mathakki, three intense feelings are expressed in the following lines:
    Thirumaal seer kelatha
    Sevi enna seviye?
    Kariyavanai kaanatha
    Kann enna kanne?
    Naraayanaa enna
    Naavenna naave?

    Ilango Adigal raises three basic questions about the purpose of the three most important of our sense organs in these lines. What is the use of ears that do not hear the Greatness of the Lord? What is the use of eyes that do not behold the Lord? What is the use of a tongue that does not chant the name of the Lord?

    For a person who has trained his five senses to keep away from the sense objects and make them perform in synchrony with the Divine Purpose, life would be a blissful melody. On the contrary, the vain pursuit of sense objects would only generate anger, frustration and finally ruin. The essence of Buddhism is based on banishment of desire which is the root cause of all human agony. There is a passage from Buddha’s Fire Sermon that is very relevant here.
    “The mind is on fire, thoughts are on fire. Mind-consciousness and the impressions received by the mind, and the sensations that arise from the impressions that the mind receives- these too are on fire.
    And with what are they on fire? With the fire of greed, with the fire of resentment, with the fire of infatuation; with birth, old age and death, with sorrow and lamentation, with misery and grief and despair they are on fire”

    The true essence of living consists in elevating our mind to a higher plane of thinking. Once we are on such a noble endeavour, the senses withdraw from the sense objects. The negative emotions are slowly replaced by a positive energy. The famous Sufi, Jalaluddin Rumi clearly enunciates the difference between the working of the mind of a normal human being and that of a highly evolved soul in these words:
    “Men’s minds perceive second causes,
    But only prophets perceive the action of the First Cause!”

    A word about the faculty of discrimination. Just as a body that is weak in immune system can be a fertile ground for diseases, a mind that is not armed with the ability to discriminate can be flooded with undesirable thoughts which in turn will force the mind more and more towards sense objects. May God grant us a discerning mind that can discriminate between the good and the evil, the holy and unholy and the Grain and the husk.
    Sri
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2008
  3. Anandchitra

    Anandchitra IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    6,617
    Likes Received:
    2,620
    Trophy Points:
    345
    Gender:
    Female
    Dear Chithra
    The subject is definetly more intense now though the underlying principle the same.
    Its interesting to note how thoughts lead us.. how thinking of sense object , desire and anger follow on each others footsteps!
    The importance of thinking thoughts are subtly emphasised. We have to be more in tune and aware of each thought as they rise. That is why we need to live in the NOW. (Power of Now by Tolle has influenced)
    I dont think its just anger that excites the mind. all low qualities have the capacity to do so. that is why one has to think positive thoughts and good ones so as not to enter the frequency of the lower sphere.
    Thanks for writing.
    I wanted to share this story from Eckhart Tolle

    A beggar had been sitting by the side of a road for over thirty years. One day a stranger walked by.
    "Spare some change?" mumbled the beggar, mechanically holding out his old baseball cap. "I have nothing to give you," said the stranger. Then he asked: "What's that you are sitting on?" "Nothing," replied the beggar.
    "Just an old box. I have been sitting on it for as long as I can remember." "Ever looked inside?" asked the stranger.
    "No," said the beggar. "What's the point? There's nothing in there." "Have a look inside," insisted the stranger.
    The beggar managed to pry open the lid. With astonishment, disbelief, and elation, he saw that the box was filled with gold.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2008
  4. corallux

    corallux Bronze IL'ite

    Messages:
    798
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    33
    Gender:
    Female
    Dear Chithraji & Cheeniyaji,

    This explanation of the Holy Gita is tailor made for me.

    Yesterday night before going to bed, I was thinking about all the people who had betrayed me, made fun of me in my bad days & even back stabbed me. The result? A bad night's sleep & I am still suffering from irritation due to lack of sleep.

    In a hind sight, I have no one but myself to blame for the state I am in today. Anger say the wise is like a fire. When used properly it is beneficial like a mother angry with her child for a reason. But let it take over your life & there you go. No end to your misery.

    I am reminded of an IL member's signature that sums up this week's lesson " Anger is like holding a burning coal to throw on someone else". I agree with the saying that Sakyamuni Buddha preached.

    Small wonder that Major Sahasranamas & prayers end with a common line " Na Krodho na cha matsaryam na lobho etc etc".

    Regards,

    Corallux
     
  5. Chitvish

    Chitvish Moderator IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    33,566
    Likes Received:
    3,756
    Trophy Points:
    490
    Gender:
    Female
    Dear Sri,
    Superb post, as ever - thank you for explaining beautifully what I wrote, perhaps, more in vedantic parlance.
    From 2.62 onwards, Krishna explains in five noble stanzas the Indian Psychological Theory on the fall of man from godhood.This is to emphasise to Arjuna that one must try to annhilaate & totally win over the indriyas from all sides, to become a sthithaprajna.
    For an unsccessful seeker the falling into sense-entanglements, is easy.Very often, the fallen one goes to the very dregs of it & there is no half-way for such victims.For them, a slip becomes destruction.
    To give an example about how a desire is created,my teacher said this.
    To create a desire, all that is required is a casual glance at a Mediterranen Cruise, that came in e mail.In fact, the whole idea of direct mail is to create a desire in you.You may call it junk mail; but for those who send it, it is not junk. They know that someone will be attracted to the idea conveyed by the brochure and to ensure that you do not forget, they also send follow-up literature. When the secod brochure arrives, the pleasant memory that had been stored, based on the first brochure, comes to mind and an interest for the subject matter develops.From this interest alone, desire develops.This is how, the desire to experience, to own, to possess is created.
    Very often, the desire is not fulfilled and that is when the problem arises.It turns into anger.The obstruction between you & what is desired is the target of the anger.
    The very meaning of anger is that viveka with reference to what should be and should not be done is lacking.
    Anger leads to loss of memory (of what we study in scriptures about right or wrong). Ultimately the mind is incapacitated.Buddhi is not available to do, what it is supposed to do, because it is under delusion.
    Thus, given that meditating on desirable objects creates problems for you, message of the Gita is clear:
    Instead of meditating on objects, meditate upon the Self, the inner self.
    Love,
    Chithra.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2008
  6. Chitvish

    Chitvish Moderator IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    33,566
    Likes Received:
    3,756
    Trophy Points:
    490
    Gender:
    Female
    Dear AC,
    Yes, sense objects lead to desire and then to anger. Delusion is the result.
    A minute, peepul seed gets into a crack in a wall, sprouts, grows and rents the wall asunder. Similarly, an evil thought germinates in the mind, develops in its own way and wrecks the man ultimately.
    Thoughts make or mar a man.
    Good thoughts mend him.
    Evil thoughts end him!
    Love,
    Chithra.



     
  7. Ashritha2008

    Ashritha2008 New IL'ite

    Messages:
    33
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Gender:
    Female
    Dear Chithra,
    Todays post has been of great relevance to me, infact i can tell to most of the people of todays world.

    You are spot on in telling that good thoughts make a man whereas bad ones mar him. I accept 100% by that.

    In our parlance, bad thoughts is when you harbour ill thoughts about someone, try to harm someone, seek the devious way to attain goals etc.

    Good thoughts are something which benefit someone, or even myself. say my desire to excel in studies and in work and in the process earn more in the long run so that i can get all the things i desire for myself and my family. I deem this as a good thought because i know i'm working towards my goal in a righteous way and do not take a short cut or find devious ways.

    But here my goal is money and fulfilling my wishes (I may along with this goal also perform pujas, donate according to my strength) which in turn are nothing but objects which satify our sense objects as described by The Gita. So is this a bad thought??

    According to Gita, the above thought expressed by me, is that a good one or bad one?? I'm keen to know your suggestions/thoughts on this matter.
    Because if it is considered a bad one, i presume that atleast 80% of people pursue similar goals and are we all at fault, is this also a not a duty of a person to work and provide for his family which needs money in this current world and to earn money you need to have the desire or the Motivation - as this is what we refer 'desire' as in our present day world.

    So if the above thought is considered a bad one are we all headed to a great downfall??

    Eager to know about your thoughts on the same. Please forgive me if i had sounded too naive. I'm slowly trying to understand the essence of these great teachings with your help. Kindly lend me your helping hand.

    Love,
    Ashritha
     
  8. Chitvish

    Chitvish Moderator IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    33,566
    Likes Received:
    3,756
    Trophy Points:
    490
    Gender:
    Female
    Dear Lux,
    Tell me one person's name who never gets angry??
    Anger is temporary insanity. When the mind is occasionally upset, it is anger; but when permanent, it is lunacy. In effect both are the same & delusion ensues in both cases.
    In the woods, the trees, creepers and plants are all easily discernible. But when there is a dust-laden tempest, the trees are tossed so much that one cannot be distinguished from the other.It is a mass of confusion. Akin to this is the state of the mind given to anger. It gets deluded first; next comes the loss of memory of the good & bad. A violence is resorted to indiscriminately, paving the way for self-destruction.
    The phala shruthis, as you have rightly pointed, are, much to meditate upon!
    Love,
    Chithra.



     
  9. mkthpavi

    mkthpavi Senior IL'ite

    Messages:
    250
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Female
    Dear C & C,

    Thursdays are dedicated to Guru Bhagavan and I think I am blessed by my 2 IL Gurus - the 2 of you - who come up with such fantastic knowledge-giving posts such as this. Thank you.

    When the mind is focussed on the Divine, it is purified and cleared of evil. Happy thoughts and optimism not just emanate from the person meditating on the Divine, but also 'infect' those around. When we visit Temples, Ashrams or natural places, dont we all experience a sense of bliss and get (at least) a momentary feeling that our problems will be solved soon? It is simply 'cos these places are closer / more in sync with the Divine, than anywhere else perhaps.

    I would like to quote 2 anecdotes in this context. Please forgive me for any factual inaccuracies in these.

    a) In Ramayana, I am told, Rishi Valmiki, was originally a thief and a murderer. Due to some situation, he started saying 'Mara Mara Mara...", which is actually very similar to "Rama Rama Rama..." - the Rama Nama. He thus, without his knowledge, actually chanted the God's name and thus became purified in heart and became the Rishi that we now hold in such high regard.

    b) In Mahabharata, there was a story where Lord Krishna advices Draupadi to stop 'meditating' on Shakuni and Duryodhana and instead focus on Him. This, He does, when, as always, Draupadi is very upset and angry understandably, at the evil that's befallen her and the Pandavas and seeks 'revenge'. In this process, her judgement is clouded and her mind is filled with anger and wrath.

    Just some thoughts. Please keep your gems coming.

    Thanks and love
    Pavithra
     
  10. aishu22

    aishu22 Gold IL'ite

    Messages:
    2,598
    Likes Received:
    112
    Trophy Points:
    160
    Gender:
    Female
    Dear Chithra,
    Well, i'm back.Went back to read the last weeks Gita Lesson and now on this.My,my - Was this writtern for me today? I have say yes to this, because i faced all the things that you have quoted: Anger - Delusion -Loss of memory, and thankgod, he gave me the wisdom before i could perish!

    There is a Tamil saying: "Aathirakaranukku budhhi mattu" - Its crisp and crystal clear that when we dont have the control of our mind,we are sure at loss.Even though this message is clear - we as just being human tend to get into this never ending cycle of anger...As you have quoted,The very seed of anger is in desire, because when we desire a particular thing to happen in a way and if its negative, we get angry.

    Today's post had given me immense strength and wisdom.Let me work upon my anger.

    Thanks Chithra for bringing us yet another wise thought from Gita.As always, your description was excellent Bow
     

Share This Page