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From gay abandon to gay acceptance!

Discussion in 'Cheeniya's Senile Ramblings' started by Cheeniya, Jul 11, 2009.

  1. Cheeniya

    Cheeniya Super Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    I earnestly hope that the 'moron' is not a reference to me!
     
  2. coolwinds

    coolwinds Platinum IL'ite

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    that advert you referenced is quite funny!

    i did not mean to put you on the spot. all of us are judgmental to varying extents, it's the honesty that counts. i find it commendable that you acknowledge where you stand on this topic, that you are able to talk about it and are open to other people's views on it.

    i am judgmental about DOM's of every stripe and believe that age and stage play an important part in how we conduct our lives.
     
  3. Ansuya

    Ansuya Platinum IL'ite

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    Cheeniya, I'll assume this is addressed to me.

    I don't think age should preclude anyone from having, changing, or expressing an opinion. We are all a product of our time and our place, but with ever-shrinking borders and a wealth of information at our fingertips, it is becoming easier and easier (and more necessary) to test hypotheses and check our own thinking and value system from time to time.

    I'm not sure language should, or even could, be separated from social issues and dynamics, but I will be a good little soldier and do as I'm told - language! However, I think my point above (about the social informing the linguistic) will be proved in tracing the etymology of the word "gay".

    The original word, as has been discussed, meant "carefree" or "joyful", from the French "gai". In the 17th century, the word became associated with immorality, or a loose and carefree lifestyle, and was initially used to describe female prostitutes. The word then expanded in scope to describe men who themselves had a lot of sexual partners (of the opposite sex).

    In the 1920s and 1930s, "gay" started being used to describe men who had sexual partners of the same sex. So, there is a tinge of scandal associated with the roots of this word. It just so happens that homosexual men preferred the term "gay" to homosexual, and so it was co-opted by this community themselves, and achieved legitimacy.

    Why this should be seen as a "tumble" in any way, I am not sure. Homosexuals deserve to be able to use positive words to describe themselves, too. And I don't think they mind if anyone should choose to use the word "gay" in its original sense, too (joyful, carefree).

    I just summarized this article

    How

    if anyone would care to read a more detailed explanation. Mystery solved (thank you, Google).
     
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  4. Cheeniya

    Cheeniya Super Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    Thank you coolwinds. I am a great fan of Jaaved Jafrey. He is different indeed!
    I want to make it very clear that I have nothing against any variations that are evolving in human relationship on moral, ethical or physical grounds. I know things will not stop with this and there will be a lot more variations in future. And we'll adopt ourselves to every change eventually.
    Sri
     
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  5. Cheeniya

    Cheeniya Super Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    Ansuya
    Of course, it was addressed to you. Whose else could be the awesome contribution to our understanding of English language in IL? Thank you very much for the trouble you have taken to educate me on this usage of the word 'gay'.
    Somehow whenever I talk of 'gay', my mind goes to Audrey Hepburn. So whenever this word comes up to mean people with a different orientation, my mind perceives it as a downfall. Hence my use of the word 'tumble'
    Sri
     
  6. Uttaraa

    Uttaraa Platinum IL'ite

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    Cheeniya,

    You thought you placated everyone with explanatory post on context of your article deliberating on the quantum leap of the semantics involved with the word and not the cultural connotations attached with its current usage (intention of the thread, as perceived by me in the first post and confirmed by you in the last post)

    Nay, nay, nay , your last phrase almost tumbled me from my settee. Tumble has taken a new meaning these days in the world of virtual currency and bitcoins. 'To tumble' is to mix with other bitcoins in different wallets and combine and recombine till it is difficult to trace the origins of the bitcoins which is causing a huge stir in the world of cryptocurrency.

    Now, I hope no one is aroused at this innocuous remark - 'took a tumble'! ;-)
     
  7. Cheeniya

    Cheeniya Super Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    Uttaraa
    You have provided an affirmation to a long standing belief of mine that I could be the proverbial Rip Van Winkle when it comes to developments in the most revered language of the world! While I was lamenting about the tumble that the word 'gay' had taken, now you assure me if it is only a 'tumble' that the word 'gay' has taken, it is no serious harm done to the word. I feel greatly relieved!

    While on the subject of tumble and its new connotation, is the tumbler in my hand any derivative of this word?
    Sri
     
  8. Ansuya

    Ansuya Platinum IL'ite

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    Cheeniya, you're quite welcome. Thanks for explaining the context in which you used "tumble".

    Generally speaking (that is, this is not directed at anyone in particular, but it is how I feel about any kind of prejudice) I think it should be an easy thing to accept the orientation of someone else, even if it is different from one's own. This goes for any situation (cultural, gender, skin color, values) where people might have differing views and behaviors.

    For me, the most important thing is freedom of choice, and the right of the individual. What I object to most strenuously is some sort of moral majority trying to tell other people what to do at the cost of the happiness of the disenfranchised group (this reasoning, of course, does not apply to crimes like pedophilia). I may not follow a homosexual lifestyle myself, but how does it harm me if others do?

    Now, I'll ask you to pardon me my self-indulgence (and it will stop here). Nelson Mandela is dead, I am sad, and it seems like a good time to contemplate humanity, tolerance, and compassion.
     
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  9. navs23

    navs23 Platinum IL'ite

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    Dear Cheeniya Sir,

    I have also known(read) 'gay' or 'gaiety' to be a word that meant 'happiness, jolly' and learnt that it also meant a way of life, only few years back.

    Grandma's reaction to such a sensitive issue, was awesome. I have seen this happen in other issues like love marriages, adoption etc. People in the older generations have seen it all, are more conservative and traditional and yet, when it comes to a big change like this, they are more tolerant and open minded.
     
  10. Cheeniya

    Cheeniya Super Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    Dear navs
    You are absolutely right about the tolerance level of older generation. I have any number of instances in my own family to prove this aspect. When my niece wanted to marry a boy belonging to a different religion, my mum pleaded her case so strongly that no one could say no. She was around 70 at that time.

    When our social awareness increases, our mindset too changes. What was unthinkable some five decades back is now considered 'no big deal at all'. Having said that, I really cannot say whether all the changes taking place now will eventually prove beneficial to humanity. Time alone can say that!
    Sri
     
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